Mod Grievance Thread

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  • #89800
    Profile photo of Illiterate Sophist
    isophist
    Keymaster

    Have a problem with how we’ve dealt with something? Here’s your place to get a conversation in about it. Public and transparent. We’ll tell you why we did it the way we did, and everyone can read it to agree or disagree with you.

    Be prepared: If you want to make your case public, that could mean making other things public. If you’re going to come in here and claim to have a clean slate, we’re going to tell people if you’re lying.

    That out of the way, the purpose of this thread is to get problems out in the open instead of growing into real issues later, when a conversation could have ended it all amicably. Give us a fair complaint or concern, we’ll give you a fair response (some replies may take more time than others). If you come in all, “Meh, I was banned, meh!” we’re going to say, “Yup.” We’ll need reasons. If we’re screwing up, we need to know.

    Quick tip: Take a few deep breaths, first. Come in raging, you’re not helping anyone.

    • This topic was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Profile photo of Illiterate Sophist isophist.
Viewing 30 replies - 631 through 660 (of 796 total)
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  • #154893
    Profile photo of mikeymcmuffin
    mikeymcmuffin
    Moderator

    As I have said to you fullmetal, I will not treat you any different than any other turbo that done the same things you have done. You were on a final warning after previously receiving a one month silence in the TF2 server for raging in voice chat specifically towards other players. You made a offensive joke and the word ‘rape’ was used in it. You were then told by a helper to stop to which you responded as though you did nothing wrong, undermining the helpers authority.

    Just like I would any other turbo in the same circumstances as you, I banned you from the server. You have repeated the same mistakes too many times and seem to only learn from them for about a week or two, then end up repeating them.

    Your ban will not be lifted.

    -Mikey McMuffin

    #154895
    Profile photo of Sven85
    Sven85
    Member

    Just checking by to say that IMHO you guys are doing a great job. None better. You act fair and (if asked) always explain your decisions in a way that everybody understands.

    Keep up the good work. Glad to be a part of a community with a moderation THAT good.

    -Sven

    #155138
    Profile photo of Aqua
    aquapainter
    Member

    I just got a time out on the Undertale stream, though a little confused since my most recent message was not wiped and other chatters had made similar comments (pertaining to the dagger in the inventory) and hadn’t seemed to have gotten any time-outs, though I realize it could’ve been a similar thing where the messages just weren’t wiped for whatever reason. I just wanted to double check on that it wasn’t a mistake or something. I do realize my message might’ve stepped a little into the “giving help when they didn’t ask for it” territory, and if that’s the case then that’s fine, but I just wasn’t sure if that was it for the reasons I said before.

    #155140
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    Hey aqua painter, I was timed out for the same reason. Don’t want to argue about it, just want to know what rule I broke. Thought Fraser was asking about his low damage. Asked if he wanted to use/remembered his dagger.

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of RadLaddy .
    #155144
    Profile photo of Martin Ellis
    mellisbaker
    Member

    Again, if they don’t ask for help please don’t blurt out tips or hints. I can’t keep track of every person that spoils something, which Undertale seems to bring out a lot of excitement and people seem to forget the rules. Unless Fraser says, “Chat, what should I do?” please don’t spoil or give hints. Thanks!

    #155154
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    Thanks Melly! It’s so strange to see people spoiling and getting frustrated with Fraser when they don’t usually, and it is most definitely because people are passionate about the game. Thanks for clearing it up!

    #155162
    Profile photo of arnez521
    arnez521
    Member

    sorry dude seems like the big shoe has spoken.sigh.but you could do what i did bulid trust elsewhere on other severs until you let back into the next one.maybe just maybe beacuse i dont control that unfortunately and while you gone idk just be more active in the forums and get into the conversations. i really can’t do nothing more than that beacuse apprenlty seem how it is there zero to no chance beacuse i do understand your situation beacuse tbh i seen worse on there and joked about but it seems like you got unlucky that day and that sucks… either way see ya and i hope you get back in threw maybe someone else in authority to in future dont lose hope dude!!

    #155163
    Profile photo of arnez521
    arnez521
    Member
    #155393

    Ok I get why I was banned from the TF2 server I don’t like it but I understand it but what the hell was I kicked from the Turbo Club Steam Group for?

    #155394
    Profile photo of Illiterate Sophist
    isophist
    Keymaster

    It’s to insure someone can’t get back in when the whitelisting plugin fails. It also insures that if we use the group for other games in the future, people can’t get in to complain and cause trouble. The purpose of the group, mainly, is for whitelisting in TF2.

    #155821
    Profile photo of Aryman
    Aryman
    Member

    Hi guys, I was banned a few months ago for disagreeing with a mod (Chrya) about the 2 chats, turbo and twitch. I believe I may have used inappropriate language and for that I apologize. I understand the turbo chat is for people who wish to support the channel above and beyond and for that they should get to be shown on stream. I do enjoy the content on the channel so if you can, could you unban me from speaking in the twitch chat? I’d appreciate it. Thanks! My twitch username is the same as on here, Aryman.

    #155823
    Profile photo of Illiterate Sophist
    isophist
    Keymaster

    I recall you complaining even after we asked you to cool it down, and the logs show you saying, “Yeah, fuck your audience, right?” in regards to having the two chats. You understand that if we unbanned you and you get banned again, that’ll be final, right?

    #155827
    Profile photo of Aryman
    Aryman
    Member

    Yes, I understand.

    #155829
    Profile photo of Illiterate Sophist
    isophist
    Keymaster

    Okay. I’ll tell the others to go ahead an unban you.

    #155830
    Profile photo of Aryman
    Aryman
    Member

    Thanks! I appreciate it.

    #156231
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    Hello everyone, I have recently come into contact with illiterate sophist, and attempted to inquire about information regarding this community and the reasoning surrounding these strict guidelines for twitch and turbo chat. I do not know how to screenshot, so I will copy his replys to me here: (in response to me asking if I could meet with fraser in person to discuss certain private issues) “Even if there were, I wouldn’t suggest that he meet with someone who both claimed they wanted mend fences in the same sentence they called him a dick”. (In responce, I explained to him that I was referring to his way of voicing his opinion is comes across to me as being somewhat dickish, as well as abrasive,) I then asked another question in regards to the community guidelines and chat rules. He then responded with this: “This is already exhuasting. No. Just no. Bye”. I would like to know your thoughts on this dialogue and if I was being rude to use this forum for its intended purpose. I would like to specify, I was not, in anyway, rude, or impolite, to anyone. All that I wanted was answers to my questions. Thanks for reading! (I realize this thread is for mod grievance, but I consider the vague, escapist replys I got to be a grievance in itself, thank you.)

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of lonely fox lonelyfox.
    #156233
    Profile photo of Aughts
    aughts
    Keymaster

    Hi, lonelyfox, and welcome!

    ISo’s likely asleep right now (as I probably should be, but, well) so I can only reply to the idea of your messages, not the direct text, though he did share the fact of the conversation to both the mods and Fraser in our mod chatroom.

    As I implied above, you’re a new face. This affords you little say at any level as to how the site and community operates, much much much much MUCH less the possibility of getting some sort of ‘IRL’ appointment with someone from the show. Or me. Or another mod. Or a helper. OR ANYONE ELSE. The ridiculousness of that is mildly staggering. If somehow ISo misunderstood your message and I misunderstood your above grievance, then it’s quite possible you also understand this.

    Beyond the above issue, and again in reply to the second part of your grievance (about rules), ISo did quote a phrase you used to describe the community we’ve fostered here: a ‘SJW Society’. Now, beyond petty politics, I do find it telling that you’re obviously using this pejoratively, and in reference to what? That we’re openly accepting of others? Or perhaps that we have… rules? Are all modern, reasonable groups with social contracts now SJW Societies? Truly, I must know. It’s important. To you, at least.

    So, of course, all of that was what was tiring to our already tired, tired ISo. Literally all of it. What kind of chip must you have on your shoulder to feel the need to not only attempt to catch the ear of Fraser, but do it face to face. I’m tired now, thinking of it. This is actually tiring. Granted, it may also be that I should be asleep.

    So yeah. Tired. Sleep. Feel free to consider this an invitation to post as long of a reply as you want. Far be it from me to shut down discourse.

    #156234
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    Allow me to respond to all of your questions and statements in numerical order: 1. How does being new deny me of any rights to ask for an audience with fraser, as well as the right to ask questions about your operation? (unless you’re hiding something, which you have led me to believe by denying me answers.) 2. How is meeting up with anyone related to, or even a member of the show, ridiculous? You went so far as to say “mildly staggering” which I have no idea what that means, and it’s getting me more and more curious and determined to find out the answers for myself. 3.You say your community is accepting, could you be a bit more specific? Because it seems to me that your concept of acceptance is far from acceptance, considering how unaccepting your people are to the right of freedom of speech, this is not a dictatorship your running here, it’s a video game show, it’s mildly staggering to me how some people can take it so mind blowingly serious. 4. I wasn’t aware that wanting to meet up with someone and bury the hatchet, so to speak, on certain issues that were disagreed with, was having a chip on my shoulder? This confuses me even more, these things I am saying are not inflammatory, aggressive, insulting, etc. How, could my words be twisted to be something they aren’t so easily? I am trying to not get frustrated, but people who make my words out to mean something entirely different make it extremely difficult. Please, for once, I would like to have a discussion without being accused of things I did not even say. Also, your making what I’m saying to be tiring, as if it’s a burden to you, or anyone, to read my posts. If it’s that terrible, I would really hate to see someone like that try to tackle real problems. Update: I just found out that isophist is an amateur author, there are two customer reviews, one from a biased source, who, ironically, chooses to not criticize the work of someone whom he knows, and an opinionated user who criticised his moderating, though this reviewer was rude to say it in that manner, isophist responded to them with an equally condescending manner. This makes me puzzled, I thought your community was accepting?

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of lonely fox lonelyfox.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of lonely fox lonelyfox.
    #156239
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    Hey @lonelyfox, I’m gonna try and give my opinion on the situation. I believe what the mods are getting at is that you seem to be new here and wouldn’t understand the reason for the strict rules. They are designed to keep the chat on show from being annoying and immature, which the crew have dealt with in the past. It gives the show a pleasant and mature atmosphere, which means it’s one of the few places on the internet (about games at least) where you can talk with people and expect well thought out answers. The rules aren’t a start-up decision by the mods to limit our speech, they are all entirely reactive to what has ruined the show before in the past. Also, in saying you want to meet with Fraser, it sounds like a “let me speak to your manager” situation, despite knowing that you just wanted to discuss it, so I could see how they would find it ridiculous if they don’t think you understand. The community is welcoming but it’s a good idea to show a good case for yourself, where it would be easier to trust and discuss these things with a long time community member who has seen the show change over time. And obviously they are actually tired and therefore disgruntled with your posts, which could be perceived as passive-aggressive. I obviously don’t know the specifics of your conversation with Iso, but I’ve known the mods to be understanding and willing to discuss grievances, as long as you didn’t squander your chances by ignoring prior warnings about what you might be doing wrong in chat (I know that’s not the issue). Assumedly you were far too insistent and were making bold claims about the community in your conversation with Iso, so he didn’t feel like he could keep talking with you and expect a pleasant conversation. That is just my assumption based on past experiences :)

    #156240
    Profile photo of Sylian
    Sylian
    Member

    As someone who wasn’t there when it happened, here’s my take on things, based on what I’ve seen written in this thread:

    1. Put yourself in his position. Thousands of people watch his videos, and he doesn’t know most of them that well. It seems reasonable to not want to meet everyone, especially with someone who apparently have bothered him before. If you really needed to contact him, for some reason, would it not make more sense to mail him?

    2. First off, there’s the issue of personal safety. Granted, the risk of getting attacked is rather low, but there’s still some risk with people he doesn’t know. Perhaps more importantly, it might be inconvenient or unpleasant for him. He is under no obligation to meet up with his fans, and even less with fans that apparently quarrelled with him.

    3. The community is accepting because it treats new members well and doesn’t discriminate based on ethnicity, nationalist, gender, sexual orientation, or religion (or anything else), as far as I know.

    If you think the community is not accepting, then provide some evidence. How is the community unaccepting of the right of freedom of speech?

    4. I haven’t seen what you said so I cannot say. How come you quoted isophist but you didn’t quote what you yourself said?

    #156241
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    In response to radladdy: I am not obligated to make anyone who reads my posts feel a certain way about how I’m saying them, so let me ckear it up: every single one of my posts are to be taken as polite inquiries, and logical responses, I welcome correction, as well as try to see the others persons side of things. “Passive aggressive,” “making bold claims”, “far too insistent”. These are the exact opposite of how I meant my posts to be worded, I could say your posts are too “passive aggressive” or some such other, I could say anything about anyones post, why? Because that’s how I CHOOSE to interpret it. I thought about what I was going to say before I said it, and expect to not be, once again, completely misunderstood.

    #156242
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    @lonelyfox Sorry for the confusion. I’m trying to get across that I believed that you were being misunderstood. I wasn’t trying to say that you were being “passive aggressive” (I regret saying that), just trying to justify the mods’ responses based on what little I know of your conversation with Iso. How they would view it as passive aggressive. Your posts are logical and polite. What I wanted you to get from my post is how the rules have changed over time, logically and in response to problems the show has had. That is just me assuming that that is what you don’t get. Please tell me if I’m wrong

    #156243
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    In response to sylian: 1. I agree with you about mailing him, but I would much rather it be a circumstance where he can’t back out whenever he wants, I have seen his debates on twitter, and find that he tries to end the conversation when it begins doesn’t go his way, or try to belittle his opponent into aggreeing with him, as if they’re incompetent. I just know that if he ever got into a discussion with me, it would be more than likely that he would run. 2. Im not going to beat his ass, don’t worry lol. 3. you mention religion? That’s funny, because I can recall that fraser has made certain comments about that, him being an atheist and all, so superior, right? 4. I don’t know how to post the entire message onto a blank page, and I didn’t want to copy them, because they were so long, and would take a while. I put a summary on one of the above posts, though. If you think I’m lying, so be it, but I know I’m not. (I really just want a straight up answer in regards to the community please, I’m corious about it, and it shouldn’t be hard to just tell me about it. Also, I have an email, but would prefer to only share it with fraser, or he can give me his, either one.

    #156244
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    No, you’re right, sorry for getting a bit frustrated there. I completely understand where the mods are coming from, I just did not expect to be brushed off like that, it came as a surprise to me, considering I’ve seen them respond to many others before. Could you give me some examples to the problems that you mentioned? It would help my curiosity greatly.

    #156245
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    @lonelyfox Butting into your convo with Sylian :P Fraser does tend to back out of conversations when he doesn’t want it to get too heated. When the person he’s talking with makes rude comments instead of logical claims, he tends to leave it there. I’m sure that if you’re making logical responses and don’t antagonize him, then you can easily mail him to discuss it. And in regards to the religion thing, the show is humor, those comments are to shock the audience.

    #156246
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    @lonelyfox Well for example people abusing systems the show had in place to give Fraser help in the game (snarf/derp). People started using it to get away with posting spoilers in the chat, and that’s not fun for anyone. As a result a rule was set so that people only give advice when asked by the crew, and there is a separate #spoilers chat if people need to discuss it

    Edit: What would help is if you told me what specific rules you have a problem with

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of RadLaddy .
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of RadLaddy .
    #156250
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    I want to believe the shock thing, but it truly bothers me that someone that I like to watch makes comments like that toward my beliefs, especially when I saw the show and trailer for risen, which might be an ok movie. And yet, offensive comments everywhere not just from him, but from his friends as well. It makes me feel like he’s just an asshole who doesn’t respect other peoples religion. Also, a recent convo with someone on twitter regarding politics with someone who argued very intelligently ended in his backing out, he knew he was being corrected, and backed out. This seems contradictory to the rules here, and makes me feel that these rules are just downright hypocritical. (oh, and I have no problem with the rules, I just want to get the logic behind them, so far, I haven’t seen logic in anything but the spoiler parts.)

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of lonely fox lonelyfox.
    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of lonely fox lonelyfox.
    #156254
    Profile photo of RadLaddy
    RadLaddy
    Member

    @lonelyfox Sorry that you feel offended. I can tell you that it’s all a joke, and that Fraser is great in person, though I doubt that fixes anything. As an atheist I apologize and tell you that’s just how this show is. In the rules page it says the rules don’t apply to the crew, and obviously that’s to give them some leeway with their humor. They’d censor themselves before it goes to far. And by problems with the rules I do mean the logic behind them, so please tell me an example of what you find illogical, and I can tell you a reason for it

    Edit: And I’m just throwing my opinion in here, because I’ve seen how the mods operate. Their jobs are very hard and I’m trying to resolve this with you to make it easier for them. Anything I say isn’t a reflection of the show, the crew, or the mods, just my perspective on it

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by Profile photo of RadLaddy .
    #156256
    Profile photo of Aughts
    aughts
    Keymaster

    Indeed, @lonelyfox, we are just a forum for a video game show. There can be no dictatorships here, and there can be no secrets. That sentence is, of course, entirely untrue, since there is a dictator (Fraser), who probably doesn’t tell us everything (oh my god no). And indeed, it is only by said dictator’s will that we’re all on this forum, in these chats, able to have this very discussion.

    aughts strikes a pose.

    For, you see, when this great community was founded, there was tumultuous knell. And Fraser didst say, “I am the alpha… wolf. Awooo. Follow rules or shit’s goin’ down.”

    aughts shakes his head, clearing out the demons that possessed him!

    Whoa! Wow. It’s possible that demon just now was paraphrasing. But I’m pretty sure not. You see, this is a private institution. Which means we have, like most all other institutions, a social contract. This states such things as ‘don’t talk about religion or politics, because we’ll ask you to stop’. This isn’t because we’re mini-dictators, out to stop personal opinion. Especially since we understand everyone here has lives beyond this simple forum, and in almost every case has the complete ability to speak their mind on any topic without meeting a firing squad. Isn’t that grand? No, we’re just uninterested in drama llamas. And while we again understand that the majority of people who would speak on those topics aren’t drama llamas, the topics do innately attract said llamas. The funny thing is (am I allowed to admit this, fellow mods) we don’t even shut down those conversations, on the whole. We just see if they tail off naturally (on the forum, at least, where actual conversations are far more wont to happen) and they usually do! What a nice community we have, don’t you think?

    For the tired thing, I apologize, truly. I was actually tired, and it had nothing to do with you. I don’t apologize for ISo, who is far more tired than myself; and also he was right in what he said (see my last post). Sorry again.

    However, I’m not sorry about the fact that you have decided to drag ISo back into this, though you’re having a conversation with me. I can understand if you don’t see the frank insanity in trying to meet a minor celebrity face to face. If you truly must have a conversation with him, make it to a con, like everyone else. Fraser’s a busy guy, with a show to run and a community to continue fostering AS HE SEES FIT.

    But hey, good job for attacking ISophist when he’s not here. Feel free to look up the aughts, and use any number of the articles about how the aughts was the worst decade ever as fodder against me. But please don’t attack my friends. I’m selfish, and want all the glory for myself.

    PRE-POST NOT ACTUAL EDIT: And in regards to all that you just posted: excuse me what? Just to tick off a couple of points: Fraser has nor needs a reason to not follow the rules here. It’s his show. You have every right to feel that it’s somehow hypocritical, and every right to be wrong.

    I’ll just reiterate the most important points, tout de suite. This is not the US or Canada, or another country you could name. This is a private group, controlled part and parcel by Fraser. What he says, goes. This is not infringing on your rights. If, by some off chance this polite conversation ends with you being banned because you’re tiresome (just making a hypothetical here, no threats), it will not be because we have ‘backed out of a twitter conversation’. It will be because you have been wrong, and we can only go over the same tired topic so many times before you’re actually causing an issue. You are owed no explanations.

    That said, if you would like to message me, I’d be willing to explain things on such topics further. With that, I feel I’ve sufficiently answered your grievance. If you would like to say the same things over again here, I’ll disinterestedly look at it, then close the tab. Have a nice day.

    #156257
    Profile photo of lonely fox
    lonelyfox
    Blocked

    Thanks for not being a typical internet athiest and just curse me out, I just think that when they act like it’s worse when a woman gets hurt in a video game than a man, and in the same show call religion unintelligent, makes me feel like cursing him out for being an ignorant hypocrite. But if it truly is a joke, and your positive that it’s a joke, then I have no problem with him in that regard. The racist, homophobic, sexist(ironic), comments in chat are understandable. What I truly don’t get is the rules regarding commenting about frasers skills, or just criticising him in general, voicing their opinion on how he’s bad at the game. Is he sensetive? Is he embarrassed in front of his friends when his performance is questioned? I am genuinely curious.

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